Hi Jerry, I think maybe my previous email's 'punchline' came too late. Just to reiterate, the explicit motivations of a scientist (what they *say* they are doing) are not necessarily their actual motivations. This is the reason your 'evidence' (what some theorists *say* motivates them) is not conclusive, far from it. I don't think your reply (concerning unintended consequences) grapples with this point, rather it supports it. Where do we look then for further 'evidence' (better called 'justification')? Well I suggest to the content of the debate. This is 'value'. Value is crucial in the CMP. Hence this seems the better bet as to the real motivation underlying the debate. (Though it is true I am interested in the real reason as opposed to motivations, per se). It is an *implicit* motivation, not necessarily a stated one (though I think it has been made explicit by more people, more often, than you imply). Re 'Defensiveness', again I think you support my point: defensiveness has some or other positive outcome - you actually suggest one precisely in order to justify defensiveness. A debate which has no implications for a positive grasp of the world is surely without scientific merit. Re my point about a world without need for defendng the LTV (etc.): This is a thought experiment to make a point about our world, not a description of our world. Perhaps the relevance of this thought experiment is clearer now I have reiteratied more clearly the problem with your 'manifest evidence'? Re Fine on consumption, the household, etc. You will find Fine himself is keen to stress his to debt to value theory on these issues. (The best example is Fine's recent 'a personal account of the LTV'). In fact, to explain these concrete issues it is probably best to start with the key abstract one, the LTV! (Though, if I had the competence I would indeed discuss his more concrete stuff, as you suggested). RE my own line of research. Would that it were so easy to jump to more concrete issues! Certainly, one can 'examine' them (indeed I have even written the odd thing on something as concrete as the euro) but this is different from grasping their true significance within the CMP, to reconstruct them in thought (as you know very well). The latter is my aim - it takes time! Best wishes, Andy
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