From: Dogan Goecmen (dogangoecmen@AOL.COM)
Date: Fri Dec 07 2007 - 05:01:41 EST
Dear Paul Z, many thanks for your reply. My replies are below. Paul Z ======= I don't understand. In fact, I think 'they' are not 'sure' because they have not gotten a clear message from the government that this is REALLY about them. That is, the contradictory message of proposing decent economic changes as constitutional issues, rather than legislative ones, and tying these into a) eliminating Chavez's term limit, b) adding to his powers administrative regional appointees, and c) setting up broader marital law powers, leaves genuine reason to doubt the sincerity of the message. Dogan ====== Paul, to be honest I am not in a position to judge on the reproaches you make above. If you are right that Bolivarians were not sincere and they tried to present what they really wanted as something else I would agree with you. Socialist policies must always be true and open. Otherwise nothing would differ them from traditional bourgeois policies. Paul Z ======= I suggest the responsibility for the problem belongs with the government, not the lack of preparedness of workers for socialism. Dogan ====== I do not agree with this stement in general. You may be right in certain situations. But there may be many other situations in which workers may not differentiate between short and long term effects of policies suggested. Let me give an example. It has also some bearings with the debates in Venezuela. Robert Owen when he started his experiment in New Lanark one of the first measures he wanted to take was to convince parents not to send their children to work but to school instead. Parents opposed to that on the ground that they would not have enough income to live on. They however insisted on sending their children to work. At the beginning he tried to make changes in New Lanark workers opposed his policy proposals because they did not trust him. On the basis of what they have been experiencing for generations they were trying to see something else behind his policy propasals because this have been their experience with the traditional capitalist management policy. They could not believe that a manager can act in the interest of working people. Robert Owen nontheless established there a kindergarden and school to educate children. Only in the long run parents could see the real results of Owen's policies. But from then on they were behind him. But to get to this stage he had to do a huge amount of work. Only after he did not fire the people working in the mill there and did not reduce their wages in the time of economic crisis (all other companies did) they started trusting him. Anyway it is a complicated issue with the securing of the support of workers and masses.There is no straight forward solution to that ________________________________________________________________________ Bei AOL gibt's jetzt kostenlos eMail f?r alle. Klicken Sie auf AOL.de um heraus zu finden, was es sonst noch kostenlos bei AOL gibt.
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