From: Rakesh Bhandari (bhandari@BERKELEY.EDU)
Date: Wed Oct 11 2006 - 17:18:56 EDT
Ajit, however much I understand is not the question here; the point is that you have simply reinvented the wheel--do you deny this? Wow! The real wage can rise while s/v rises and s/c+v falls. You think you discovered this in a Paris cafe? This is astonishing. I think Sraffian hubris has really interefered with your understanding of Marx's most basic insights. I can't see how this is not clear to everyone on this list other than you. I guess you won't be answering my three requests for clarification of what your "propositions" are. Rakesh --- Rakesh Bhandari <bhandari@BERKELEY.EDU> wrote: > >> > --- ajit sinha <sinha_a99@YAHOO.COM> wrote: >> > >> >> --- Francisco Paulo Cipolla <cipolla@UFPR.BR> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> > I do not think the maximum rate of profit >> argument >> >> > is a mathematical >> >> > tautology since it is grounded on the idea of a >> >> > rising composition of >> >> > capital (rising c/L) which is a historical >> >> tendency >> >> > of capitalism. >> >> > Rising rate of exploitation and falling rate of >> >> > profit go together. >> >> > Wasn´t this that Ajit said it was difficult to >> >> show? >> >> > Paulo >> >> ____________________________ >> >> Paulo, let me first quote you. You wrote: >> "Then,the >> >> argument goes, IF the value composition of >> >> production >> >> c/L (as Shaikh(?) calls it) presents a tendency >> to >> >> increase, the maximum rate of profit L/c must >> >> present >> >> a tendency to fall." (emphasis added). Your >> >> qualifyer >> >> "if" makes your statement almost a tautology. Why >> >> did >> >> I say almost and not a tautology? Because a pure >> >> tautology would be a statement such as: 'either >> it >> >> is >> >> raining or not raining'. This statement, though >> >> gives >> >> you no information about the weather, is always >> >> true. >> >> Your statement is always true but on the >> condition >> >> that the elementary methematical law that if the >> >> value >> >> of a ratio is rising then its inverse must be >> >> falling. >> >> So for all practical purposes it is a tautology, >> but >> >> since a philosopher could protest, I took the >> >> measure >> >> to protect against such criticism by calling it >> >> almost >> >> a tautology. >> >> >> >> Now you say, "Rising rate of exploitation and >> >> falling >> >> rate of profit go together. Wasn´t this that Ajit >> >> said >> >> it was difficult to show? >> >> >> >> First of all, since you have put your V = 0, >> which >> >> means the rate of exploitation is infinite even >> if >> >> the >> >> working time is one second, the concept of >> "rising >> >> rate of exploitation" is meaningless. In any >> case, >> >> what the rate of exploitation has got to do with >> >> rising rate of composition of capital? And why >> >> cannot >> >> you understand my proposition which you are >> making >> >> me >> >> repeat time and time again? Let me repeat it for >> the >> >> last time. My proposition is: show me how the >> three >> >> tendencies exist together: (1) real wages, i.e. >> >> wages >> >> in terms of goods and services, is rising; (2) >> the >> >> share of wages in net income, which is divided >> >> between >> >> capitalists and workers, is declining; and (3) >> the >> >> rate of profits on capital investment is >> declining. >> > ______________________ >> > This evening in a Paris café I tried to work this >> out >> > myself. Of course in a limiting case when rate of >> > profits tend to zero, the share of profit in the >> total >> > net output will also tend to zero. However, if we >> > start from a high level of rate of profits and >> assume >> > that all the surplus value is invested mostly in >> > increasing the constant capital and very little in >> > increasing the variable capital with productivity >> > rising just to the extent that the rate of profits >> > falls slightly, this trend could be maintained for >> a >> > long time. Of course, a time has to come when the >> rate >> > of profits become small enough that the share of >> wages >> > begin to rise vis-a-vis the profit in the net >> output. >> > But the mathematical possibility of the three >> trends >> > existing simultaneously for some time cannot be >> > denied. Cheers, ajit sinha >> > >> >> Ajit, >> >> You didn't have to work this out; it has been long >> understood that these >> three trends (plus two) could exist simultaneously. >> >> Why are you reinventing the wheel on this list? >> >> It is inappropriate that you question the reading >> knowledge of others >> while you don't seem to have read Howard and King's >> two volumes or at >> least much beyond the second chapter of the first >> volume... >> >> Rakesh > ________________________ > Rakesh, I don't think you understand much of anything. > It was my mistake to engage with you after ignoring > you for a long time. Now from now on, as most of the > others do, I'll simply ignore you for good. ajit sinha >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> > __________________________________________________ >> > Do You Yahoo!? >> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam >> protection around >> > http://mail.yahoo.com >> > >> > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com >
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