[OPE-L:5244] Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: use-value as qualitative

From: Steve Keen (s.keen@uws.edu.au)
Date: Fri Mar 23 2001 - 17:15:22 EST


Hi Paulo,

Perhaps your students did not consciously reason as I am doing, but I think 
their logic was inherently close to the mark. When you say that "we could 
not subtract value from use value the same way we cannot subtract the value 
of a pen from its use value as a means to write", your logic crosses from 
the M--C--M+ circuit back over to the C--M--C circuit. In the M--C--M+ 
circuit, all use-values are inherently quantitative to the relevant 
consumer--which is the capitalist. In a pen is part of a production 
process, then its qualitative use-value is a necessity, but peripheral to 
the use-value which matters to its capitalist consumer--its ability to help 
generate surplus value.

So I think you may indeed have been giving lower marks than justified!

Cheers,
Steve

At 10:43 AM 3/22/01 -0300, you wrote:
>I've been teaching political economy for a decade now and a question i 
>have consitently asked in my exams was: Use the concepts of value of labor 
>power and use value of labor power in order to derive surplus value. 
>Interestingly enough and against my explicit emphasis the students 
>insisted in just subtracting the value of labor power from the use value 
>of labor power. I went out of my way to explain to them that we had first 
>to convert the use value of labor power into a quantitative dimension 
>before we could subtract the value of labor power. I repeated over and 
>over again that we could not subtract value from use value the same way we 
>cannot subtract the value of a pen from its use value as a means to write. 
>The conversion of the use value of labor power into a quantitative 
>dimension is its actual use for a specific period of time. Outside its 
>actual use we cannot obtain its quantitative dimension. That's also the 
>reason why capitalists are so zealous in making sure this quantitative 
>dimension is put to good use. Was I giving lower grades than due for this 
>past decade?
>Paulo Cipolla
>
>Steve Keen wrote:
>>  Hi Jerry,
>>
>>I use the old Progress Press edition.
>>
>>This quote is the point at which Marx first reveals the source of 
>>surplus-value in Capital I.
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Steve
>>At 09:38 AM 3/20/01 -0500, you wrote:
>>>It is unclear to me in what edition of Volume 1 of
>>>*Capital* on 'p. 188' Steve K cited below in [5189].
>>>However, for reference, it is from Ch. 7, Section 2
>>>in a paragraph that begins "Let us examine the
>>>matter more closely."  In the Kerr edition, this
>>>paragraph is on pp. 215-216. In the International
>>>(1939) edition, see pp. 174-175. In the Penguin ed.,
>>>see pp. 300-301. An interesting difference in
>>>translation concerns "the value which that labor-
>>>power creates in the labor process" (Kerr) vs.
>>>"the value that labour-power valorizes [*verwertet*]
>>>in the labour-process" (Penguin). Note that in all
>>>cases the VLP and the "value that ...." concern
>>>value as such, not uv.
>>>
>>>In solidarity, Jerry
>>>The past labor that is embodied in the labor power, and the
>>>living labor that it can call into action; the daily cost of
>>>maintaining it, and its daily expenditure in work, are two
>>>totally different things. *The former determines the
>>>exchange-value of the labor power, the latter is its use-value.*
>>>The fact that half a [working] day's labor is necessary to keep
>>>the laborer alive during 24 hours, does not in any way prevent
>>>him from working a whole day. Therefore, the value of labor
>>>power, and the value which that labor power creates in the labor
>>>process, are two entirely different magnitudes; and this
>>>difference of the two values was what the capitalist had in
>>>view, when he was purchasing the labor power... What really
>>>influenced him was the specific use-value which this commodity
>>>possesses of being a source not only of value, but of more value
>>>than it has itself. This is the special service that the
>>>capitalist expects from labor power, and in this transaction he
>>>acts in accordance with the 'eternal laws' of the exchange of
>>>commodities. *The seller of labor power, like the seller of any
>>>other commodity, realizes its exchange-value, and parts with its
>>>use-value.* (capital I, p. 188.)
>>Dr. Steve Keen
>>Senior Lecturer
>>Economics & Finance
>>Campbelltown, Building 11 Room 30,
>>School of Economics and Finance
>>UNIVERSITY WESTERN SYDNEY
>>LOCKED BAG 1797
>>PENRITH SOUTH DC NSW 1797
>>Australia
>>s.keen@uws.edu.au 61 2 4620-3016 Fax 61 2 4626-6683
>>Home 02 9558-8018 Mobile 0409 716 088
>>Home Page: http://bus.uws.edu.au/steve-keen/
>
>Dr. Steve Keen
>Senior Lecturer
>Economics & Finance
>Campbelltown, Building 11 Room 30,
>School of Economics and Finance
>UNIVERSITY WESTERN SYDNEY
>LOCKED BAG 1797
>PENRITH SOUTH DC NSW 1797
>Australia
>s.keen@uws.edu.au 61 2 4620-3016 Fax 61 2 4626-6683
>Home 02 9558-8018 Mobile 0409 716 088
>Home Page: http://bus.uws.edu.au/steve-keen/



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